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Age of Kings Heaven » Forums » General and Strategy Discussion » What history books did the AoK creators used as reference?
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Topic Subject:What history books did the AoK creators used as reference?
Doidimais Brasil
Squire
posted 05-11-20 10:10 AM CT (US)         
Is there any list?

(yes, I searched the original game manual, no bibliography).

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MawBTS
I ONCE PUT AN ENTIRE ORANGE INTO MY MOUTH
(id: Bart Pimpson)
posted 05-12-20 11:50 PM CT (US)     1 / 8       
I've never seen a bibliography either. I suspect Ensemble Studios just grabbed information from wherever: library books, university courses, web pages...

AoE2 design lead Greg Street is on Twitter, you could ask him: https://twitter.com/Ghostcrawler

Designer Sandy Petersen was asked for a list of his favorite history books once, and provided one. It's possible (but not certain) that some of these books were used for reference in the games.

Keep in mind that ES was notorious for adding stuff because they thought it was cool or made the game better. I doubt we'll see a cite for Korean war wagons or medieval Persian elephants any time soon.
Charging_Knight
Squire
posted 05-13-20 05:36 AM CT (US)     2 / 8       
Dave3377
Squire
posted 05-13-20 03:47 PM CT (US)     3 / 8       
I suspect that Cinema was also (sadly) a factor in these decisions too. The Celts in particular seem to be very Braveheart inspired despite that movie's historical inaccuracies. Woad raiders weren't even a thing by the AoK time period.
Doidimais Brasil
Squire
posted 05-13-20 10:44 PM CT (US)     4 / 8       
MawBTS, that was very useful. Thank you. Tweeted Greg Street.

In the game itself, obviously the games takes precedence over history.

However, there's a History section in the game with plenty of history, i.e. 'The Castellation of Europe', which always fascinated me.
Charging_Knight
Squire
posted 05-14-20 09:28 AM CT (US)     5 / 8       
They could have called it a Gallowglass for the Celts and given it some face paint but outfit it properly in armour and a helmet with a big axe, not in those pyjama pants and bare-bodied look.
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[This message has been edited by Charging_Knight (edited 05-14-2020 @ 09:36 AM).]

Simfish
Squire
posted 06-18-20 11:41 AM CT (US)     6 / 8       
OMG Doidimais Brasil, YOU WERE ONE OF THE FIRST FORUMERS WHO WAS SUPER-NICE TO ME AND I'M SO GRATEFUL TO YOU FOR IT!!

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Kataphraktoi
Squire
posted 06-21-20 01:43 PM CT (US)     7 / 8       
Ive noticed mainstream game developers like to put semi-fantasy or highly romanticized depictions into their games because their ignorance of history leads them to think they need to do this for variety. Rome1 Total War is a good example, the base game came chock full of nonsense but the realism focused mods had none of that yet far greater unit variety since the passionate fanbase dug deeper to find ways to mix up units and make it interesting and authentic.

Some of the games bad unique units come down to not developing the game deeply enough, though. The samurai was intended early on to switch between spears and its katana, but for time\budget reasons that kind of stuff got left out. Jannisaries are particularly obnoxious to me, since that level of gunpowder unit really doesnt make sense starting in castle age. Elephants for persia sorta make sense, except IMO the elephant has never once been a viable form of combat except once for surprise value. A waste of money otherwise.

My favourite books...the peloponesian war by thucydides has to be my favourite. Just gave it a read through and I quite like his (translated) odd but interesting sentence construction. Also I just finished reading "the history of rome" by livy, what an absurdly lengthy account that got quite tedious to finish.

"Excellent could be any map that has the quality of a ES random map or ES scenario. AoK is an excellent, award winning game. That's where I'd start." -AnastasiaKafka

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Dave3377
Squire
posted 06-24-20 07:59 PM CT (US)     8 / 8       
While we are at it: Can anyone find any historical account of people fight from camel back during the AoK timer period? I have never found any.

They were used to scare cavalry and transport infantry across the battlefield at Battle of Thymbra, but those troops dismounted to fight. Also that predates AoK (547 BC).

There is one mention of mail clad camel-riding spear throwers here: http://www.tertullian.org/fathers/herodian_04_book4.htm But that was also pre-AoK period.

Others, including the Romans used camels for patrols and transports in the desert, but again, not as a "battle mount" as far as I can find.
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