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Topic Subject:AOE2 Definitive Edition
Jatayu
Squire
(id: Sword_of_STORM)
posted 06-19-19 01:56 AM CT (US)         
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtpN-Af9xvo

So who here is excited for AOE2-DE ?

I hope they do a really good job and make it easy to do modding/data editing. And keep the game going for many years more..

,
Jatayu O===|¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯/
`
Battle of Saraighat, 1671|Atlantis, the Lost Realm|AOE Roman Modpack|My profile
ि
StormWind Studios
AuthorReplies:
Mahazona
Squire
posted 06-19-19 04:58 AM CT (US)     1 / 32       
Gameplay and graphics looks great but im going to wait for 6 months after the release to see how it will work.AOE DE had many issues.
Mash
Huskarl
(id: Mashek)
posted 06-19-19 05:59 AM CT (US)     2 / 32       
I'm pretty excited. I really like the revamped graphics and new sound effects. The general effects make everything feel so much more lively.

There's another video here showcasing 9 minutes from the demo if anyone's interested.
genghis quan
Squire
posted 06-19-19 12:11 PM CT (US)     3 / 32       
What's going to happen to our scenarios?

Will triggers be backwards compatible?
HELLKNIGHT61
Squire
posted 06-19-19 12:15 PM CT (US)     4 / 32       
I have some questions about Age of Empires 2: DE.


1-) If we paste our campaign's files into DE's folders will our old cpx, cpn, scx, and scn files work in DE perfectly with DE's graphics?

1a-) Is it compatible with User Patch 1.5 scenarios and Data Mod scenarios that also have used User Patch 1.5 in the past?

1b-) Is it compatible with HD or HD's expansion scenarios and Data Mod scenarios that also have used HD or HD's expansion scenarios in the past?

1c-) Is it compatible with steam HD or steam HD's expansion scenarios and Data Mod scenarios that also have used steam HD or steam HD's expansion scenarios in the past?

1d-) Is it compatible with CD Age of Empires 2 or CD Conquerors's expansion scenarios and Data Mod scenarios that also have used CD Age of Empires 2 or CD Conquerors's scenarios in the past?


2-) Does it will be enough to resurrect Age of Empires 2 scenario designers ( like Ingo van Thiel ) and mod designers for creating new files? ( NOT remastered files NEW files )


3-) Does it will be enough to resurrect Age of Empires 2 Community here or other websites?


4-) Will it cause to "reduce activity" of standard steam HD players, standard CD Age of Empires 2 players and standard UserPatch players due to having a better alternative?
Lord Basse
MI6 Scenario-Making Machine
posted 06-19-19 12:26 PM CT (US)     5 / 32       
@genghis, from what I've heard, at least scenarios should be backwards compatible.

@HELLKNIGHT, you're probably better off posting most of these questions a the official AoE forum, no one here is a developer.

2) Some perhaps, but I think most old designers quit/drifted away from designing for a reason, namely real life work and relationships taking up more time.

3) Hopefully, and we'll have a better chance to ride the wave of renewed interest with an updated site and forum.

4) Maybe, at least once it comes to Steam. If they don't significantly upgrade the scenario editor, though, there will probably still be a lot of people who prefer UP.

__[]_________
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The ||||||||||||||||| Hus
OF | [/ \] |¯| [/ \] | ME
______________________________________________________________________________ |__ _ |¯|____|_______________________________________________________________________________
The Relics of Athalën (5.0) | AoK Opus - 95,000+ downloads | StormWind Studios | "I consider the conversion of Basse to be one of the great triumphs of my modding crusade" - Matt LiVecchi
Kataphraktoi
Squire
posted 06-19-19 04:35 PM CT (US)     6 / 32       
No steam, no buy

Rah rah, fight the powa, yeah...

"Excellent could be any map that has the quality of a ES random map or ES scenario. AoK is an excellent, award winning game. That's where I'd start." -AnastasiaKafka

"Hard work is evil. Bitmaps are stupid. Working on a scenario for more than one afternoon is stupid. Triggers are stupid. Testing your own scenario is stupid. The world is stupid. You are the Greatest." -Ingo Van Thiel
Mr Wednesday
Cavalier
(id: matty12345)
posted 06-19-19 05:39 PM CT (US)     7 / 32       
It's on steam.

There is a video of Cysion playing a scenario that's a bit concerning. He is using attack move and also tasking groups of units. There are less than fifty units fighting probably and at least a third of them sit there and do nothing. He was talking about the game and distracted so it's possible his units somehow got on no attack stance? Trying to be hopeful that's the case, because otherwise the pathfinding looks absolutely worse than HD.

"And Matt is a prolific lurker, watching over the forum from afar in silence, like Batman. He's the president TC needs, and possibly also the one it deserves." - trebuchet king
Kataphraktoi
Squire
posted 06-19-19 05:49 PM CT (US)     8 / 32       
Hmm, so its on steam but I keep hearing no steam workshop from people. Thats very weird.

Regardless of how good it is, without community content from the workshop not many games can survive on their own.

"Excellent could be any map that has the quality of a ES random map or ES scenario. AoK is an excellent, award winning game. That's where I'd start." -AnastasiaKafka

"Hard work is evil. Bitmaps are stupid. Working on a scenario for more than one afternoon is stupid. Triggers are stupid. Testing your own scenario is stupid. The world is stupid. You are the Greatest." -Ingo Van Thiel
Mr Wednesday
Cavalier
(id: matty12345)
posted 06-19-19 07:46 PM CT (US)     9 / 32       
It's cross platform play between Microsoft store and steam. But due to being on both sites mods and scenarios will be handled through the AoE website possibly. Which is...probably bad.

"And Matt is a prolific lurker, watching over the forum from afar in silence, like Batman. He's the president TC needs, and possibly also the one it deserves." - trebuchet king
Julius999
Imposter
posted 06-19-19 08:45 PM CT (US)     10 / 32       
Whoever did the path-finding for AoK must have been a programming genius (or team of geniuses). Not only was it a vast improvement from the rather ropey path-finding of the original AoE and in fact breaks down very rarely, it is apparently impossible for programmers now (HD and DE) to surpass it or even match it.

Is anyone able to provide any insight into why this is, understandable to a lay person?

1010011010
[ All_That_Glitters | Pretty_Town_Contest | Other_AoK_Designs | AoE_Designs ]
Member of Stormwind Studios
Darth Sarek
Squire
posted 06-19-19 10:08 PM CT (US)     11 / 32       
@Julius999, While the pathfinding in AoK was (is) good, it was far from perfect. My biggest gripe with the game in general is the way the units move in formation. I hate that I can have a enemy unit completely surrounded, order my troops to attack, and watch as they turn around and walk away from the target, just so they can get into a nice rectangle formation before they attack. It's so frustrating! Rams are the worst offenders. I've ordered rams to attack a gate a few tiles away, nothing in between, and saw them turn about-face, and just roll away in the opposite direction... It just makes me laugh at how absurd it is, lol.

In my opinion, the best unit pathing I have ever seen in a strategy game is Starcraft 2. It just seems buttery smooth compared to any other game I've played. That's not to say AoK's is horrible, I just wish I could turn off the formation thing sometimes. AoK is still my favorite game of all time.
Jatayu
Squire
(id: Sword_of_STORM)
posted 06-19-19 10:15 PM CT (US)     12 / 32       
Whoever did the path-finding for AoK must have been a programming genius (or team of geniuses). Not only was it a vast improvement from the rather ropey path-finding of the original AoE and in fact breaks down very rarely, it is apparently impossible for programmers now (HD and DE) to surpass it or even match it.

Is anyone able to provide any insight into why this is, understandable to a lay person?
I asked this question to a developer ( ES_Sandyman? ) on this forum a long time ago ( sorry can't find thread ). His reply was that they had a rather genius implementation of A* algorithm in which the unit when tasked over a long distance chooses an approximate path and then changes its path depending on what obstacles come in the way.

I actually didn't realize how good the pathfinding in AOE2 was until I played some other RTS games like Command and Conquer series, where the pathfinding is like, total sh!t.

,
Jatayu O===|¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯/
`
Battle of Saraighat, 1671|Atlantis, the Lost Realm|AOE Roman Modpack|My profile
ि
StormWind Studios
Mash
Huskarl
(id: Mashek)
posted 06-20-19 03:07 AM CT (US)     13 / 32       
There is a video of Cysion playing a scenario that's a bit concerning. He is using attack move and also tasking groups of units. There are less than fifty units fighting probably and at least a third of them sit there and do nothing. He was talking about the game and distracted so it's possible his units somehow got on no attack stance? Trying to be hopeful that's the case, because otherwise the pathfinding looks absolutely worse than HD.
Cysion does say on a website (forgot which one) that not only was he distracted but many of the units were on stand ground/no attack stance. You can actually tell this when the units are all selected because no stance is highlighted, which usually happens when units are set to difference stances.
Kataphraktoi
Squire
posted 06-21-19 10:47 AM CT (US)     14 / 32       
The AoK pathfinding is good in scenarios, but tends to break down under the pressure of multiplayer or when thousands of units are being moved. Anyone who has used siege onagers to counter paladins in multiplayers know what I'm talking about....those matches will test your endurance and willpower to the limit

"Excellent could be any map that has the quality of a ES random map or ES scenario. AoK is an excellent, award winning game. That's where I'd start." -AnastasiaKafka

"Hard work is evil. Bitmaps are stupid. Working on a scenario for more than one afternoon is stupid. Triggers are stupid. Testing your own scenario is stupid. The world is stupid. You are the Greatest." -Ingo Van Thiel
HockeySam18
Dúnadan
posted 06-21-19 03:55 PM CT (US)     15 / 32       
Anyone who has used siege onagers to counter paladins in multiplayers know what I'm talking about
A regular occurrence in the RP games that used to happen on AoKH from time to time, haha.

Storm on the Steppe | Galderton Hill RP | Proud member of Stormwind Studios

"Cattle die, kindred die, every man is mortal:
But the good name never dies of one who has done well." - Hávamál

"Hockey is the only sport left for true men." - ax_man1
Mash
Huskarl
(id: Mashek)
posted 06-21-19 07:12 PM CT (US)     16 / 32       
Anyone who has used siege onagers
Yep. That said, I can't believe I never used to build siege onagers in online games. Those things are game changers!

[This message has been edited by Mash (edited 06-21-2019 @ 07:12 PM).]

genghis quan
Squire
posted 06-25-19 11:58 AM CT (US)     17 / 32       
@hockeysam are you involved with DE at all? Did they ask you to make any scenarios?
Mr Wednesday
Cavalier
(id: matty12345)
posted 06-25-19 07:59 PM CT (US)     18 / 32       
Sam is part of FE, and FE is one of the studios involved in the Definitive edition, so it's very likely.

"And Matt is a prolific lurker, watching over the forum from afar in silence, like Batman. He's the president TC needs, and possibly also the one it deserves." - trebuchet king
BF_Tanks
Squire
posted 07-01-19 01:36 PM CT (US)     19 / 32       
I hope you all signed up for the beta Third wave is in mid-july.

Proud Member of Black Forest Studios
Co-creator of Silent Evil - Voted Best Multiplayer Scenario of 2009
and The Seas of Egressa - Voted Best Multiplayer Scenario of 2010
Charging_Knight
Squire
posted 07-02-19 11:28 AM CT (US)     20 / 32       
I signed up a long while back but I have not received the beta... Strangely. Anyone knows what might be the issue? I actually designed some of the scenarios for the Indian campaign in AOE2:FE. Hope to be able to contribute through participation in the beta this time around as well.

Domus Dulcis Domus --- Home Sweet Home...ZzZzZzZzZ
BF_Tanks
Squire
posted 07-02-19 11:51 AM CT (US)     21 / 32       
unlucky draw I guess

Proud Member of Black Forest Studios
Co-creator of Silent Evil - Voted Best Multiplayer Scenario of 2009
and The Seas of Egressa - Voted Best Multiplayer Scenario of 2010
kud13
Squire
posted 07-03-19 00:47 AM CT (US)     22 / 32       
Pretty stoked for AoK DE. I'll probably buy it Day 1, though it'll probably take me until end of the year to finally upgrade to Windows 10- I'm planning to rebuild my PC over the Black Friday/Boxing Week sales, and then I'll be able to enjoy it.

Here's my personal wishlist/what I need to get to make sure I spend as much time on DE as I spent on HD (close to 1250 hours, no multiplayer and no standard games)

1) provide compatibility tools for a scenarios and campaigns from earlier versions. I probably close to 70 custom campaigns on HD, from the Blacksmith and Steam Workshop, and there needs to be a simple way for DE to bring those over.

2) bake in the changes from the Independent architecture mod- i e, let us mix and match architecture for each civ without being reliant on civ groups. This would provide so much more flexibility and variety to modders that it'll ensure the game's longer life span.

3) performance fixes (pathfinding, as well as optimization- hopefully multi-core support, but since it's supposedly the same base engine, maybe it's too much to hope for.

Really curious to see what FE will do with the Cumans. As a Ukrainian, they figure prominently in our history books, but essentially only as raiders who'd pillage the Ruthenian principalities (often invited to by various princes who used them as mercenaries in the dynastic struggles for the right to rule over Kiev, the "capital" city of Rus. I'm looking forward to see what the Cuman campaign will cover.
BF_Tanks
Squire
posted 07-03-19 08:25 AM CT (US)     23 / 32       
From what I've heard, DE will ship with a conversion tool for converting .scx and .aoe2scenario maps to the DE format.

Proud Member of Black Forest Studios
Co-creator of Silent Evil - Voted Best Multiplayer Scenario of 2009
and The Seas of Egressa - Voted Best Multiplayer Scenario of 2010
Lord Basse
MI6 Scenario-Making Machine
posted 07-03-19 06:15 PM CT (US)     24 / 32       
From what I've heard, DE will ship with a conversion tool for converting .scx and .aoe2scenario maps to the DE format.
Now that would be good news!

__[]_________
|||||||||||||||||
The ||||||||||||||||| Hus
OF | [/ \] |¯| [/ \] | ME
______________________________________________________________________________ |__ _ |¯|____|_______________________________________________________________________________
The Relics of Athalën (5.0) | AoK Opus - 95,000+ downloads | StormWind Studios | "I consider the conversion of Basse to be one of the great triumphs of my modding crusade" - Matt LiVecchi
DarkPaladinX
Squire
posted 07-07-19 06:46 PM CT (US)     25 / 32       
Also, a representative from Microsoft confirms they're done with adding more new civilizations in Age of Empires 2: DE after the new four civs are added into the game.

RIP Tibetans in Age of Empires 2.
BF_Tanks
Squire
posted 07-07-19 09:52 PM CT (US)     26 / 32       
Oh, no more civs? Thats.. Interesting.
Who else has access to the beta? There's some really telling stuff if you look in the strings file.

Proud Member of Black Forest Studios
Co-creator of Silent Evil - Voted Best Multiplayer Scenario of 2009
and The Seas of Egressa - Voted Best Multiplayer Scenario of 2010
Lord Basse
MI6 Scenario-Making Machine
posted 07-08-19 05:13 AM CT (US)     27 / 32       
No more civs is probably for the better at this point, honestly, as long as you can mod in new ones as you like.

__[]_________
|||||||||||||||||
The ||||||||||||||||| Hus
OF | [/ \] |¯| [/ \] | ME
______________________________________________________________________________ |__ _ |¯|____|_______________________________________________________________________________
The Relics of Athalën (5.0) | AoK Opus - 95,000+ downloads | StormWind Studios | "I consider the conversion of Basse to be one of the great triumphs of my modding crusade" - Matt LiVecchi
DarkPaladinX
Squire
posted 07-08-19 02:45 PM CT (US)     28 / 32       
No more civs is probably for the better at this point, honestly, as long as you can mod in new ones as you like.
I think I kinda agree that there is too many civilizations. You get to the point where you run out of ideas for unique units, civilization bonuses, and unique techs to the point that you will come across ridiculously OP civ bonuses like Stable units having extra pierce armor that scales per Age or Relics you secure in your Monastery give your military units combat stats. While I personally do like to see civilizations like Swiss, Tamil, and Tibetans in Age of Empires 2, there is simply too many civilizations in Age of Empires 2 where you have the newer civilizations have very awkward or very unusual gameplay mechanics (i.e. Khmers can build any building or advance to the next Age without pre-requisites and the Portuguese Feitoria). And you have an issue of power creep where newer civilizations can do certain strategies better than the older civilizations (the Berbers are arguably the best civilization to do Knight rushes from a competetive standpoint, even better than Huns or Franks doing Knight rushes) or civilizations that are just underwhelming (i.e. Vietnamese in 1v1 games). Then of course, there is an issue of gameplay balance vs. historical accuracy, but that's a different story.

That being said, I'm hoping that the Forgotten Empires dev team adds modding support for modders that can add new civilizations at ease or modify the current civilizations. I know some games like Civilization V/VI have very good modding support where you can add new civilizations/leaders/etc. or modify existing civilizations and it's certainly possible with cross platform modding support that Age of Empires 2: DE will have.

[This message has been edited by DarkPaladinX (edited 07-12-2019 @ 05:46 PM).]

BF_Tanks
Squire
posted 07-11-19 01:43 PM CT (US)     29 / 32       
They've already confirmed that they're going all in on mod support. They've also said they will use the AgeofEmpires website as the platform for uploading/downloading.

If you believe the leaks on reddit, supposedly they have around 10 "reserved" civ slots in the data files which may be entirely for modders to add their own civs.

Proud Member of Black Forest Studios
Co-creator of Silent Evil - Voted Best Multiplayer Scenario of 2009
and The Seas of Egressa - Voted Best Multiplayer Scenario of 2010
SafeKeeper
Squire
posted 09-22-19 08:04 AM CT (US)     30 / 32       
Actually, I think AoK is already great enough that all I can say is I hope they bring back map screenshots :P . I'm still not over them being gone from the Steam version.
Kataphraktoi
Squire
posted 09-23-19 03:54 PM CT (US)     31 / 32       
I dont care about civs, but I definitely love and desire more architecture sets

"Excellent could be any map that has the quality of a ES random map or ES scenario. AoK is an excellent, award winning game. That's where I'd start." -AnastasiaKafka

"Hard work is evil. Bitmaps are stupid. Working on a scenario for more than one afternoon is stupid. Triggers are stupid. Testing your own scenario is stupid. The world is stupid. You are the Greatest." -Ingo Van Thiel
SafeKeeper
Squire
posted 10-05-19 05:31 PM CT (US)     32 / 32       
Would be great if they added an Attack Move button or mode that made units advance, but only target enemy units while ignoring buildings. Attack-move in its current form isn't that useful when storming an enemy town, my units just start whacking away at enemy houses while the enemy attack them :P .
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