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Age of Kings Heaven » Forums » General and Strategy Discussion » Are many people aware of the original Age of Empires 2 graphics?
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Topic Subject:Are many people aware of the original Age of Empires 2 graphics?
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ELiTE TEUTONiC
Squire
posted 01-15-11 08:55 AM CT (US)         
I'm not sure if there are many long termers here (by long termers I mean original Age of Empires 2 fans who were around with its inception) but the game actually had different graphics to what you see in the final game. This version was scrapped, and to be honest with you I find the original graphics quite appealing. I will try and find the original magazine pictures and scan if for you.

Firm believer in micro-management.
Introducing one of the greatest 2D RTS Medieval mods, Sword & Arrow: European Wars

[This message has been edited by ELiTE TEUTONiC (edited 09-12-2011 @ 09:14 AM).]

AuthorReplies:
local boi
Squire
(id: dragon14)
posted 09-21-12 01:51 AM CT (US)     976 / 1201       
I've never tried a free to play game..

USA
katsup or mustard

[This message has been edited by local boi (edited 09-21-2012 @ 02:25 AM).]

Basse
Squire
posted 09-21-12 10:00 AM CT (US)     977 / 1201       
basse, I guess then you were of the minority who didn't chose to pirate one game or the other. And in no way is F2P = P2Win all the time. There are a lot of titles that are like it, but not every successful title is like that.
I prefer games like Battlefield 3 or Starcraft 2. They are available both in stores and on the web. It's still almost impossible to pirate a version that works in multiplayer. Too bad they had to remove the LAN option
Alexastor
AoEO Seraph
(id: Kastor)
posted 09-21-12 11:06 AM CT (US)     978 / 1201       
And they're still a dying breed. I'd love to see a StarCraft II like AoE4, but it's not onto us to decide that.

I doubt a new 2d RTS game can be successful anymore nowadays, unless it's easily accessible via browser - which means F2P.
Lurkur
Squire
(id: OtmShankIiI)
posted 09-21-12 02:22 PM CT (US)     979 / 1201       
Clearly you can afford that credit card. /thirdworldproblems

"Seriously, if human stupidity could be used as a source of power wed already be a class-III civilization and our rockets wouldve reached Andromeda by now."
Cliffs! (4.5)

["I am the True God, Lua-kuh. Hhsssss. Start the Church of the Talking Lizard. Hssssssss. Build the Neo Temple. Spread the Word. Hssssssssssss. Follow meeeeeeeee... to... the otha... siiiiiiiide..."

And then he started belting out vague poetry about wanting to have sex with his mom." -From the great old Aro, about a dream I had.]
AOE_IS_SWEET
Squire
posted 09-21-12 05:36 PM CT (US)     980 / 1201       
I too hate f2p games. I would much rather slap down $20-$40 up front and get the full game to play as much as I want for no more money.
local boi
Squire
(id: dragon14)
posted 09-22-12 04:06 AM CT (US)     981 / 1201       
Isn't it technically 2.5D? the units in aoe always look 3d enough to me, they just can't rotate :
Edit: wasn't funny
But really computers can handle 3D now, it's not a major concern of mine. What is a concern is the gameplay getting lost under the graphics.
I doubt a 2D RTS game can be successful nowadays for that reason period. I also read once, not sure if it's true, but bear with me, that 3d models are easier/cheaper to make than the sprites for a 2d game. If it's true, mind=blown.

USA
katsup or mustard

[This message has been edited by local boi (edited 09-22-2012 @ 04:34 AM).]

Sebastien
Dark Samurai
posted 09-22-12 07:06 AM CT (US)     982 / 1201       
In order for a an Age of Kings 2 (or Age of Conquerors 2, or Age of Empires: The Conquerors or whatever it's called) to work, all the developer has to do is replicate, improve but not destroy. Exactly what Starcraft 2 is to Starcraft and not what Microsoft did with Age of Empires Online.

To me, there are two sides of AOK which make it so successful. The gamers side and the designers side.

The gamer used to play the single player scenarios and a few LAN games with his mates, but has since moved on to multiplayer online matches and enters tournaments and clans and whatever else.

The designer spends most of his time in the editor, trying to create cool maps for people to play. He might play multiplayer every now and then, and he most likely plays other peoples custom scenarios; but mainly it's designing.

Then you have inbetweeners and offshoots. Like people who do both, play and design a lot (like people who design multiplayer maps to play online etc). Then you have people like modders, who like to turn the game upside down and create new graphics and units etc or expansions.

For the Gamer...

The gameplay is absolutely fine already and doesn't really need to be altered; the concept works!

There are a few AOK community patches which get rid of some bugs and annoyances (like the user patch) and a similar thing should be done with a new game.

So for example, boars would still be boars, but the AI WOULD be able to hunt them. Everything replicated, but then bugs removed or common annoyances taken off.

The multiplayer side for AOK is still very strong. For the gamers, a new game is just a graphical improvement without the annoying bugs, and a few cool additions. Those multiplayer guys should fit right into an already winning game style and play style. Except they get HD graphics (obviously with the option to turn off fog, enhanced lighting etc for people with less powerful machines), bigger screen resolutions and voice chat. They still feel ike they are playing their loveable Age of Empires 2, but it's better, balanced and built with the community in mind.

For the people who USED to play it, it's like, "hey, i remember that awesome game, I used to play that when I was a kid, I'mma buy it". And the new kids, will look at it and think "Cool, a medieval rts!", and then play it and think "Cool, this is fun, simple to play and I'mma start learning strategies, my fave civ is this and that and blah blah blah".

For the Designer...

For longetivity side, enhance the editor, add more triggers, conditions, effects etc and allow complete customisation for the potential modder and scenario designer. (and maybe the tools to do it). We had modpack studio for aok at first (which was very good but improvements needed), but the data editing side was poor.

It's taken 10+ years for us to have some decent quality modding tools. Which is great coming from the community. But having an industry tool capable of doing anything would hopefully keep the game more active for longer.

You're trying to inspire people. Give them more tools to play with, let them be free and creative. Let them make that epic campaign they have in their head with minimal headache. Don't know what to include? Then ask the scenario design community for Age of Empires and Age of Empires 2. Get feedback and then build the editor around that. If the editor was originally an after thought, then well, actually it's built a huge successful part of the AOK world, and hopefully the designers would help those people and give them something they want after all these years. It also gives them a reason to switch to the new game, without any complaints.

If you don't make the tools, then allow the modding community to do so. Let us edit the data, in the same way we can now, but explain it better. Let us add new civs, or new terrains, or make flying units etc. Let us add new particle effects or modify skins or the colours of the lighting styles etc. (Think Dawn of Fantasy style editor).

Graphics wise...

Age of Empires 2 in 3d should look like Age of mythology, but with much better graphics (and also the editor navigation in age of mythology SUCKS compared to aok). I'm talking perspective and so on.

Orthographic, and simple. Maybe, maybe people can freely rotate and zoom in, but to me I'd keep it simple and probably not even allow that. Depends on feedback.

Graphics would be very very good, great animated water with waves and fully interactive with objects. Great lighting etc and generally next gen styles of rts, but still AOK!

Apart from the additions, the graphics would look similar to what they do now, except in 3d. So barracks would like current barracks etc, but obviously improved. Play around with university so it looks prettier, or modify the churches (make these unique to each civ), but generally, its all recognisable.

There would be more terrains and lots of environment objects, to create different worlds (similar to AGE of mythology, but much better quality). Each piece would be to honour the original game, however, things would be added; like different rocks, cliffs, and general gaia nature pieces to make each area unqiue.

Think of any location, desert, tundra, african type planes, europe plains to jungles to lucious green pastures etc. Each location has it's own trees, bushes, plants, animals. Animals would be split into huntable groups. For example, in europe it's sheep, but in asia it could be goat. It could be boar or buffalo or lion or wolf etc. However, again, thinking of the longetivity and the scenario designer, all animals will have the option to be huntable in the 'editor' for scenario design purposes.

Maybe even make each civs building unique. Units are a bit more confusing, because if you change names or appearances things drift off from aok and make things confusing. Unless of course it was purely asthetical, and still had all the same stats and same tech line. Or make more unique units. OR, just allow modders to edit skins and models etc, so they can add their own units if they really want to for scenario designers. It's probably not as important to your average multiplayer player.

General Improvements...

Then of course, throw in a few features (like the vil idle button tell you how many vils are idle, improve the mini map and whatever else; throw in a couple of new civs (maybe Thailand, or African Civs etc), improve the balancing and ai and pathfinding etc and you're done.

Blah blah blah blah....

Please make it so, Microsoft!

[This message has been edited by Tetsuo Shima (edited 09-22-2012 @ 07:44 AM).]

Slartibartfast
Squire
posted 09-22-12 07:43 AM CT (US)     983 / 1201       
African civs would be pretty cool!

"His name has to be sneezed out" - Aro
"Slobberingbastardfart" - Scud
"Slutty-barf-fast" - Mozzarella Man


You should join I am Jack's Mafia
Draconian Devil
Squire
(id: DraconainDevil)
posted 09-22-12 12:07 PM CT (US)     984 / 1201       
*agrees with tetsuo*
Please Microsoft please!!

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Basse
Squire
posted 09-22-12 12:26 PM CT (US)     985 / 1201       
As if they would care!
Lurkur
Squire
(id: OtmShankIiI)
posted 09-22-12 12:38 PM CT (US)     986 / 1201       
You've just read mine and hundreds of others's mind, Tetsuo.

"Seriously, if human stupidity could be used as a source of power wed already be a class-III civilization and our rockets wouldve reached Andromeda by now."
Cliffs! (4.5)

["I am the True God, Lua-kuh. Hhsssss. Start the Church of the Talking Lizard. Hssssssss. Build the Neo Temple. Spread the Word. Hssssssssssss. Follow meeeeeeeee... to... the otha... siiiiiiiide..."

And then he started belting out vague poetry about wanting to have sex with his mom." -From the great old Aro, about a dream I had.]

[This message has been edited by Lurkur (edited 09-22-2012 @ 12:38 PM).]

Alexastor
AoEO Seraph
(id: Kastor)
posted 09-22-12 12:52 PM CT (US)     987 / 1201       
I'm sorry to break it for ya, but as nice as it sounds, it's pretty unlikely, as you're basically talking about a remake. In no way is anyone going to make a 1:1 copy of AoE2 in 3d.

We'll much rather see a StarCraft II like sequel: It did keep the original's gameplay and ideas, but it changed a lot in the details (units, upgrades, maps, a couple of mechanics, etc.).

You'll have to have with a few sublte changes, like infinite farms, slightly faster pacing, and weaker defensive structures, while retaining AoK's mechanics. If someone brings a sequel they don't want only the hardcore AoK'ers to play it. If you really just want AoK, a patched version should do.

And even if we see a StarCraft II like sequel, we might have to end up with F2P. Today, Dustin Bowder (Lead Designer on SC2) said they're looking into ways to make its multiplayer F2P. They're having a really hard time trying to compete with free games like League of Legends and DOTA 2. And I doubt that will change with upcoming titles like Command and Conquer. And if they do this, they're not doing it because they're mean or hate the core gamers. They will do it, because they have to to survive.

[This message has been edited by Alexastor (edited 09-22-2012 @ 05:19 PM).]

local boi
Squire
(id: dragon14)
posted 09-23-12 01:49 AM CT (US)     988 / 1201       
I'm of the opinion that when you go out to update and re-release something, you don't fix what's not broke. You take out the bugs, add some features, and give it a new coat of paint, but the underlying mechanisms are the same.

And I have to disagree with you on where the games are: I'm sure most of them are the regular people who, sure, maybe they play an occasional multiplayer game, but love this game for the single player game and campaigns and the atmosphere it provides. I think a feature update to this game that allowed for, at the least, better crafted dynamic random maps in single player would be a huge success and an improvement to this atmosphere, instead of the current balance that sees single player games be so bland. For multiplayer, it is a necessity, I will agree, but in a single player game, it would be cool. Or just a ton of new campaigns. Either or :P

USA
katsup or mustard

[This message has been edited by local boi (edited 09-23-2012 @ 01:53 AM).]

Jetkill Fastmurder
Squire
(id: Mayank Sharma)
posted 09-23-12 08:28 AM CT (US)     989 / 1201       
Can't an indie team buy the game's rights from Microsoft, edit it and sell it with 90% royalty going to Microsoft? Set it at a competitive price at which Microsoft would be able to get in royalty what it gets in total revenue right now. (AOK sales are very less today, and it would help them get more money, which is their eternal goal anyway) Isn't this possible?

"Man cannot remake himself without suffering, for he is both the marble and the sculptor" - Alexis Carrel
Dawn of Fantasy Heaven Census II
Alexastor
AoEO Seraph
(id: Kastor)
posted 09-23-12 08:39 AM CT (US)     990 / 1201       
Are you talking about AoE2 or the IP rights?

Considering how much interest there still is for the Age of Empires series, no. I'd be really surprised if AoEO was the last title in the series. Microsoft knows what went wrong with AoEO (and they started to fix it up already), and they know how strong the series still is.

And I doubt an indie team would have the manpower and money to be able to create a squel that can compete with AAA titles like StarCraft 2 and CoH2. When it comes down to fixing AoE2 and re-releasing it, nobody has to buy the rights and give Microsoft royalties. MS could just hire a team (or person) to do it instead. Considering how much money they could make with re-releasing a fixed AoC on Steam for the hardcore players, and/or a F2P browser version for the more casual ones, I think it'd be stupid not to do it.

Also, re-releasing a rebranded AoM as Age of Empires: Mythologies on Steam (with working keys!) would benefit the series as well.

Whohoo, 10 more posts to go!

[This message has been edited by Alexastor (edited 09-23-2012 @ 08:45 AM).]

Jetkill Fastmurder
Squire
(id: Mayank Sharma)
posted 09-23-12 10:16 AM CT (US)     991 / 1201       
MS could just hire a team (or person) to do it instead. Considering how much money they could make with re-releasing a fixed AoC on Steam for the hardcore players, and/or a F2P browser version for the more casual ones, I think it'd be stupid not to do it.
Then why didn't they do it already?!

"Man cannot remake himself without suffering, for he is both the marble and the sculptor" - Alexis Carrel
Dawn of Fantasy Heaven Census II
Alexastor
AoEO Seraph
(id: Kastor)
posted 09-23-12 12:43 PM CT (US)     992 / 1201       
Because they didn't have anyone who was or felt responsible for it. You can't make decisions when there's nobody who is able to make such a decisions.
Their current executive producer Kevin Perry is responsible for the whole AoE series, so it might (have) changed with him. If I'm not mistaken he ordered AoE3 to be released on Steam and other platforms.
Jetkill Fastmurder
Squire
(id: Mayank Sharma)
posted 09-23-12 01:34 PM CT (US)     993 / 1201       
Yeah, AOE3 is on Steam. If only they spent a few months into reworking our dear game...

"Man cannot remake himself without suffering, for he is both the marble and the sculptor" - Alexis Carrel
Dawn of Fantasy Heaven Census II
Alexastor
AoEO Seraph
(id: Kastor)
posted 09-23-12 02:50 PM CT (US)     994 / 1201       
If only? Maybe they do.
Dead_End
Cavalier
posted 09-23-12 03:27 PM CT (US)     995 / 1201       
A lack of details does not indicate a lack of activity.
Alexastor
AoEO Seraph
(id: Kastor)
posted 09-23-12 06:33 PM CT (US)     996 / 1201       
Exactly. And if I make a post to reach the 1000 faster, is it considered spam?

[This message has been edited by Alexastor (edited 09-23-2012 @ 06:34 PM).]

TOAO_DaVe
Squire
(id: Tonto_DaVe)
posted 09-23-12 06:41 PM CT (US)     997 / 1201       
Maybe, but does it matter? I think this thread is GSD's version of splash splash.

Signed,
DaVe.
Lurkur
Squire
(id: OtmShankIiI)
posted 09-23-12 08:13 PM CT (US)     998 / 1201       
Except it does have a theme in common.

"Seriously, if human stupidity could be used as a source of power wed already be a class-III civilization and our rockets wouldve reached Andromeda by now."
Cliffs! (4.5)

["I am the True God, Lua-kuh. Hhsssss. Start the Church of the Talking Lizard. Hssssssss. Build the Neo Temple. Spread the Word. Hssssssssssss. Follow meeeeeeeee... to... the otha... siiiiiiiide..."

And then he started belting out vague poetry about wanting to have sex with his mom." -From the great old Aro, about a dream I had.]
AOE_IS_SWEET
Squire
posted 09-23-12 09:46 PM CT (US)     999 / 1201       
Sure, a common theme, like reaching 1,000 posts. :P

(Only one more to go!!)
Leif Ericson
Seraph Emeritus
posted 09-23-12 09:52 PM CT (US)     1000 / 1201       
Yay!

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